Rusted power steering line concern

[ComputernerdBD]

Hey everyone. Well it seems I have the infamous problem of the power steering lines rusting where that rubber boot is above the front left wheelwell.... I don't even want to remove that boot unless I have a way to replace the damaged section. I also have an issue with the metal line on the steering rack rusting right where the line goes into the fitting on the passenger side. While I realize that the fix for the normal lines is to replace them, is there a way to cut out the damaged section and replace them in the same manner as brake lines? As for the pipes directly on the steering rack (http://www.carsteering.com/data/all_images/RA-2009NQ-1100-Map.JPG), I cannot even find that part anywhere. Anyone have any suggestions? It seems like a part that can be removed/replaced, but is it available without buying a whole steering rack? I also need to replace the PS pump due to end play but can all this be done without replacing the pump or should it all be done at the same time? Thanks

 

[DAlastDON]

That looks awful. I hope you noticed it before it started leaking. Replacing the lines is a bitch from what i understand. There were some posts in the past few weeks discussing repairing the rusted sections.

 

[Mounce]

do a little searching here and you'll find answers to one, if not all, of your questions.

People have repaired the lines in the past like a brake line as you mentioned. I think they actually used brake line for it, too.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

It is not leaking right now. I am looking to get this before it starts leaking. So the line replacement really is a bad repair?

With the steering rack lines, I reworded my search (not lines, steering rack pipes) and found something interesting... Part numbers 26100270 and 26100271. Maybe I should look into replacing the lines like a brake line, abolishing the rubber hold down bracket (which in my personal opinion is one of GM's worst design flaws) and just ordering these two to fix the rusted lines under the truck? Thanks

 

[Mounce]

From what everyone says, it is not an enjoyable job.

 

[Capote]

Dang I can't remember the thread in which someone recently replaced that section of lines. They cut them and put in a new section with fittings. If I find it I will link it here for you bud

 

[Mooseman]

If they're not leaking yet, save yourself the trouble. The reason they rust is because of that rubber grommet thing that they pass through. It holds dirt and water. Carefully take them out of that holder, clean them and protect them with some brushable rust paint. I recommend that you don't put that rubber grommet back.

If it does leak, only the low pressure return line can be repaired. Most just use fuel line with hose clamps. Others have used a section of same sized brake line with compression line fittings, like in this post:
https://gmtnation.com/forums/threads/power-steering-lines-rotting-away.1929/post-39502

The high pressure line can't be fixed and must be replaced.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

Thanks all for the info....

Regarding the high pressure line, how do I know whether to order the original or alternate design when the time comes to replace them? It is an 07. Not even double flare brake line fittings will handle the pressure on the high side?

With the rubber grommet, is there a safe way to remove it without compromising the lines if they really are in as bad of a shape they could be under there?

Thanks

 

[ComputernerdBD]

Ok I took the grommet off to see what the damage is. I was actually pleasantly surprised. I was expecting the lines to snap in half when I went to take the grommet off because it was so difficult to remove. They are rusted and starting to flake but no leaks. The pipe under the truck on the rack lost a tiny flake on the pipe at the fitting (almost not noticeable but I will get a pic next oil change) but also no leak. Only because they were flexing and I was concerned about clearance between both of them and the shock tower, I cut the grommet in half and put one half back on the cleanest part of the line I can find. I left the bracket off for now. So other than replacing the power steering pump and checking the steering rack pipes at a shop, with this new info how do you guys suggest I proceed with this project? Leave them alone, paint/monitor them or replace them? Thanks so much for the assistance

EDIT: I also started the truck and turned the wheels lock to lock several times and I cannot find any wetness on the lines.

 

[DAlastDON]

It is too bad that we can not do what they do on metal ships to prevent corrosion.

Thought it was a good read.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galvanic_anode

 

[ComputernerdBD]

Agreed.

Now regarding the bracket: Should I even think about putting that back on? I tried with only half of the rubber part on there and it would not work. If the lines are able to move side to side a tiny bit, is that dangerous? Can metal fatigue come into play in that manner? Or should I eventually look into getting the same type of supports that are on the frame in front of the shock tower?

How much rust is too much on these lines without them leaking?

 

[Mooseman]

I don't have the bracket nor the rubber isolator on neither of my trucks.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

I don't have the bracket nor the rubber isolator on neither of my trucks.

Interesting.... So those lines should be fine as is without additional brackets?

 

[Mooseman]

I just tied them with zip ties to each other to keep them from moving around.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

Hey everyone. Well it seems it may be worse than I thought since I took a mirror to the underside of the line which is worse than the rest of the line. So I may consider getting these replaced soon. How do I determine the proper AC Delco part number since Rock Auto has an OEM and alternate design? Also how bad of a repair is it in term of labor hours? Thanks

 

[Mooseman]

If you stay with the OEM design, then you won't have anything special to do except replace it. The alternate, you have to remove the original cup seal in the rack. it apparently has less of a chance of leaking. If you replace the tiny cup seal, only the dealer has it and it's like $25. The alternate design just uses a regular o-ring.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

So basically my choice is - either stick with the OEM design and replace the cup seals to prevent leaks or have them remove the cup seal and use the alternate design pipes and the chance of leaking is less with the O-ring? If I go with the alternate design, anything else I need to connect them to the truck other than the hoses themselves? Obviously I should paint them and not put the bracket back in, correct? I see there is an OEM vs alternate for the pressure hose but is there a design choice on the return gear to cooler line? I was looking at AC Delco parts 36365451 (pressure, alternate design) and 36365781 (return, gear to cooler). Thanks so much for the information.

EDIT: How bad of a repair is this in terms of labor hours if I look into getting them professionally done?

 

[Sparky]

I remember someone joking that GM built these trucks around the PS line. Guess it is a bit of a pain to do.

I haven't heard of a lot of leaks with the cup seal, but if you're supposed to replace the seal when you replace the line (which would make sense) and the seal costs that much, I'd be tempted to convert to the O ring seal.

Remember, there are two return lines. One goes from rack to the cooler, another goes from the cooler back to the pump.

My low pressure line from cooler to pump went totally bad on me but I replaced it with a length of 3/8" fuel/oil hose from Autozone for like 10 bucks. It was really easy to just fish the hose where it needed to go and I just clamped it on. Might be an option for you perhaps. It will never rust again and may be easier to snake around than the hard line. I wouldn't do that for the high pressure side as I don't think a simple clamp would hold it in place.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

Wow..... At least I won't be surprised when I call the shop then.

Makes sense... Looks like the alternate design it is then.

Right, although I was not looking at the one between the pump and cooler right now since it is fairly clean. Both of them above the left front wheel are the problem thanks to the infamous bracket which is no longer there.

Interesting..... if it was only return line, I may have considered that but the pressure line is not far behind. GM really messed up this time on design especially since these trucks do see alot of snow.

Thanks for the info.

 

[Sparky]

What's interesting is on my truck the line from pump to cooler was the worst. It just folded up when I barely put any pressure on it when I was changing my pump out. Just been keeping my fingers crossed on the rest of the lines and so far so good.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

What's interesting is on my truck the line from pump to cooler was the worst. It just folded up when I barely put any pressure on it when I was changing my pump out. Just been keeping my fingers crossed on the rest of the lines and so far so good.

Interesting. What part of it was the worst? I am looking straight down past the fan on mine and I can't really see any rust. Last time I checked from underneath I didn't find anything of concern also. Even from the top on the lines above the wheel they are rough but not too bad until you grab a mirror and start looking at the sides and bottom of the line.

 

[Sparky]

It was the horizontal part right before it bends upward towards the pump. Mine folded right before that upward bend. Sounds like yours is fine.

 

[Mooseman]

I changed both pressure and return lines that go above the shock tower when I replaced my timing chain because a lot of stuff was removed making it easier. Apparently the bolt directly under the harmonic balancer that holds the hoses to the frame is a pain.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

Ok I got the lines today and it looks like the return line has a cup seal with it and the ends are totally different between pressure and return.... Is this a problem? Should I return the pressure line and get the OEM design? Will a difference between the two cause an issue? Thanks

 

[Mooseman]

Not at all. The return line stayed with the cup design. The new pressure line with the o-ring design should have also come with a line retainer (the one that bolts to the rack to hold both lines) to accommodate the two different lines.

 

[Menthol]

Does anyone have a idea how much pressure were talking about ....I can get hydraulic lines to fit one end of a compression fitting and compress the one other to the line. Would that work, the line will be about rated1000psi

 

[Sparky]

The line should be fine it is just the connection I'd be concerned about. I don't know exactly what pressure they run (I've read upwards of 800 PSI on some pumps when worked hard).

 

[Tiggerr]

Never never use compression fittings at that pressure. Spend the $ and get proper lines. Not worth the risk

 

[ComputernerdBD]

Ok so an update: Lines installed today but I am far from happy. Painted them up and they not only installed them poorly without any of the original clamps (I actually had to go back and then they explained they were too small so they used zip ties to stop them from moving.), ripping the paint off in the process but they are not run the same as the others and they are rubbing together in multiple places..... One part of the return line is scraped from being against the shock tower also, but not sure if it is just a paint scratch or a gash in the line. Another part of the pressure line is rubbing against the hose clamp on the return line. No leaks I can see so far. But as someone who works in IT I was pissed to see that they removed the old lines in a way that cuts out (pun intended) any backout plan since they cut them in half to remove them. I am attaching photos. I ordered two packs of these ( http://www.amazon.com/QuickCar-Racing-Products-66-852-Clamp/dp/B003TTX5YC ) but how could I make them work in this application especially for the lines that are pressed together? I want to make sure they are all secure and not rubbing. I ended up temporarily using the two halves of the original boot that caused the lines to rust in the first place to protect them. Also it looks like they removed the cup seals with the old lines but not sure if they checked to see if there was anything left in the rack. They also tried to pin blame on the parts but they were AC Delco. Not from a stealership but probably 100x better than the normal aftermarket parts. How best should I proceed with this in terms of securing the lines and checking for damage they did? I don't even think I will go back now that I looked at this further, which is a separate matter but doesn't help much since I am supposed to be going on a trip in less than 3 weeks and need this fixed ASAP. Thanks

 

[Mooseman]

For on top of the shock tower, you could use the clamps you ordered in pairs, top and bottom, basically sandwiching the lines to secure them. The original clamps were garbage anyway so those should be good. I wouldn't lose any sleep over this as long as they don't rub to the point that they will actually wear into the line. Mine are secured with zip ties, no problem here.

It does happen that the cup seal comes out with the line so it actually makes that part of the job much easier. The new lines should have come with new seals anyway.

 

[ComputernerdBD]

For on top of the shock tower, you could use the clamps you ordered in pairs, top and bottom, basically sandwiching the lines to secure them. The original clamps were garbage anyway so those should be good. I wouldn't lose any sleep over this as long as they don't rub to the point that they will actually wear into the line. Mine are secured with zip ties, no problem here.

It does happen that the cup seal comes out with the line so it actually makes that part of the job much easier. The new lines should have come with new seals anyway.

So basically putting them back to back and zip tieing them together where they are against each other?

Perfect, thanks, so that means they did that part right at least as long as it isn't leaking.

So what kind of bolts should I be getting especially if they need to drill? Self tapping?

 

[Mooseman]

That or self drilling and tapping.

 

[vgz96e]

I have a 2007 Trailblazer. I had the power steering cooling pump replaced late December 2013 at a cost of $600 (it died on Christmas morning). About 2 months ago, I developed a slow leak from the power steering. I've put 3 bottles of Prestone Power Steering Fluid with Stop Leak in it over the summer. My mechanic wants $45 just to look at it and tell me what's the cause of the leak - he says if it's the cooling pump, he'll fix that for free because it's still under warranty. I live in Jersey - my stepdaughter just had a heart attack in VA and I want to drive down to see her but don't want this thing to blow out completely while I'm driving 65 MPH on the turnpike. From what I've researched online, there are problems with the power steering lines rusting out.

 

[Sparky]

Easy to tell if that is where it is leaking from. Pop the hood and look at the shock tower on the driver side. If it is all oily you've found the source.

 

[Mooseman]

Also check under the left side of the bumper/air dam as the cooler also has a tendency of rusting through.

Your mechanic probably meant to say "power steering pump" is covered unless it was the cooler he replaced. Rarely have I heard of a pump leaking though.